Sofo Archon Interview (June 2016)

BY SOFO ARCHON

This is an interview I gave back in 2016 on the Conscious Living Podcast with Natasha Grey.

May you learn and enjoy.

Transcript

Natasha: Sofo’s writings touch on a wide range of disciplines, including philosophy, psychology, religion, but all of them, though different in topic, share something in common: they point to a better way of living.

I would like to start with that today, Sofo. I’d like to start around what are these shared commonalities between these disciplines of philosophy, psychology and religion, and how can they or do they point to a better way of living?

Sofo: I’ve always been interested in learning how I can personally live a better life, and how we could collectively create a better world, a more beautiful world. And in my journey to finding answers about how we can achieve that, I started reading. I started reading a lot. I started reading books on philosophy, psychology, spirituality, religion, ecology… in order to find answers to my questions. And I think that from all these disciplines there are things we can learn in order to create a better life for all of us.

Now if you study, let’s say, psychology, you learn better how your mind influences your body and how important interpersonal relationships are in your life. If you read philosophy, you can try to find answers about existential questions that I think more or less we all have: “What is the meaning of life?” “What is the purpose of life? “How can we live better?” And also religion and spirituality: “How can we connect with our higher self? “How can we find peace and harmony with ourselves and others?” So I think that all these disciplines can help to create a more spherical understanding of ourselves, of the world, and of our relation to the world.

I think that we should not so much be focused on being an expert on some particular field or discipline, if we want to better get to understand ourselves in the world. We need to gather knowledge and information from as many sources as we can, from different disciplines, from different schools of thought. And the more we do so, we develop a more spherical understanding.

Natasha: What were some of the major teachings that you can recall upon right now that you really incorporated into how you lived your life from all this reading, from all this research, from this immersion of information? What did it look like in how you took that and actually brought it into who you are and how you guide your life today?

Sofo: Well, there are a lot of teachings out there and I really don’t know from where to start. I guess what I came to realize is that the cause of all suffering is starting from our worldview. And the worldview that most of us have is what I call—and others before me have called—separation. It is the idea or the belief that I’m here as an individual, you’re there… you’re separate from me, and we are living in a world that is separate from us, outside of us. Now this kind of worldview creates a lot of problems on many different levels.

On the individual level, we start feeling alienated, we start feeling lonely. We stop trusting other people… although, you know, we are inherently social beings. Psychological research shows that the more connected we feel with others, the more happy we are, and the better our overall well-being is. Also, when we feel alone in a huge universe that is actually separate from us, we begin to have existential issues. We feel that we are not important, that we’re not significant, that we have nothing unique to offer, and that our life does not really have any true meaning.

Then we see that, on the social level, people start competing with one another. Because what everybody does, and is conditioned to do, by systemic pressures of society is to believe that what we are here to do is maximize our rational self-interest. And, if I’m here, and you’re there, and I only want to care about myself no matter how my actions are actually negatively impacting others, then I’m bound to be in conflict with others. So we see people competing with one another, we see corporations competing with one another, we see countries competing with one another, and from this kind of mentality all war and all violence, all domination and control, arises.

And also, we see the results of this worldview of separation on the planet. We see that the way we are living is destroying the environment. We are poisoning the sea, we are cutting down rainforests, we are pollutinh the air. We don’t feel connected with the world; we feel separate. But the reality is that we are actually connected. The Earth is an organism and we are all part of it, and it is sustaining us. So the more we destroy it, the more we are bound to actually destroy ourselves, because we are part of it.

This is perhaps the most important lesson that I have learned in my journey, and this is actually the core of everything that I’m trying to communicate and teach through my work.

Natasha: How do we begin to heal this view that we have of being separate from all, essentially—from the planet, from others, from other countries, from even our closest loved ones, not to mention from ourselves?

Sofo: This is I guess one of the most important questions one can ask themselves.

I think that everything begins with self-love. You know, we’re being brought up doing things that we don’t like doing. From a very young age, from when we start going to school, most of us are being forced into doing things that don’t sprout from our heart. We learn things that we don’t enjoy learning. We follow a predetermined path, and we have been told that the way we are, we are not enough—that we need to be somehow different. And slowly, slowly we stop trusting ourselves, we stop trusting our inner voice, and at some point we even begin to hate ourselves.

When we become separated from who we are, when we start hating ourselves, then we begin to hate or not like the world around us. Because I’ve realized that the world is to a great extent the reflection of our own minds. The way we perceive the world is the way we perceive ourselves. So if we are in inner conflict, then we are bound to be in conflict with others.

In order to start finding peace within ourselves, we have to do a lot of things. We need to start expressing ourselves, preferably in a creative way. And we need to start spending time with ourselves… You see, we are living in a culture of distraction. We don’t want to spend any time alone, and a big reason why is that we don’t feel comfortable with who we are. We don’t want to come in touch with our thoughts, with our feelings… And I think that the best way we can come in touch with ourselves, and be more calm, and find a more peaceful state of mind, is to use the tool of meditation. Which is really the most important tool in order for one to open the doors of happiness, so to speak.

So I would suggest people to start pursuing their passions, to start doing more of what they love doing, to stop doing what society is forcing them to do… Of course, I know that this is difficult. It is not something that can be achieved very easily. But I think that this is our aim—to learn to creatively express ourselves, to find time to come in contact with ourselves, to listen more to ourselves, and to embrace ourselves. And meditation is a practice that is really, really beneficial.

Natasha: It’s almost like meditation acts as almost an outlet or a reason to give yourself that stillness and that quietness, to perhaps express yourself in a creative way. And I really appreciate how you used creativity as a form of healing, because I’ve actually never heard it point blankly said like that and it really resonated with me. Because I know in the therapy room, whenever I was working with children, as well as adults, and I would have them do something creative, it was another form of just allowing them to be, rather than having them perform necessarily in some way. Which is just an expression of who they are without any judgment or anything attached to the outcomes. So I appreciate you saying that.

Sofo: Yeah, you know, I am a painter so I can tell you a lot about creativity from my own experiences. When I do something that I love, such as painting, I sometimes find myself lost in that painting. The sense of self—that is, my worries, my past, my future—all disappear. And sometimes I enter into that state that psychologists have termed flow—the flow experience—which to me is not so different from meditation. Of course many of us do it, but not subconsciously—so we don’t really realize how beneficial creativity is. But I think, yes, we need to start to create more, we need to start to express ourselves more. And once we do this, once we are in harmony with ourselves, then we will start seeing the world with different eyes. We will start feeling more connected with others. And I think that’s what we all deep down desire, this experience of connectedness.

Natasha: Through our authenticity of being who we are.

Sofo: Yes. Right.

Natasha: Which actually brings me to one of your latest blog posts about being crazy in a sick culture is actually a healthy thing. I’d like to have you maybe chat about that and share with our listeners—what do you mean by that? And what does being “normal” mean to you, and how can our craziness actually be healthy for us?

Sofo: Okay. In order to let you know more about what I think, I should go a little back in my early childhood. Since I was very young, I was feeling that there is something wrong with the way we live. And this sense of wrongness started to appear in my life when I first went to school. You know, as a child I wanted to go outside, to be with friends, to play, to creatively express myself, to climb trees… to do all sorts of things that made my heart pulsate with joy. But society told me otherwise. I had to stay confined in a small classroom, to obey rules, to obey authority, to have to learn things that I couldn’t care less about learning. And I was feeling, “What is the point of living this way?”

And, you know, adults would tell me, “Well, actually you should be grateful for the life that you have, because when you reach adulthood and become one of us, the problems are going to grow even bigger.” And I should enjoy myself as a child because when you’re an adult you have more duties, more responsibilities, more things to worry about. And I could see, really, adults from my family—you know, my relatives, my parents—that would just wake up in the morning—they would actually force themselves to wake up—and they would go to do some work, some kind of work that they hated doing. And then they would go back home, and they would watch TV for a few hours to relax, and then they would go to sleep. And then they would repeat the same things the next day for the rest of their lives. And I was thinking, “What is the point of living like this? I don’t want to live like this.”

And so whatever was given to me, whatever was handed down to me from tradition as normal, I just didn’t accept. And at some point in my life when I was a teenager, I started to doubt all the beliefs that were handed down to me. I questioned the school system, the economic system, my diet, religion, and all other things. And I started to create my own path in life. I started to do things that were not, I guess, so normal. And I found that whenever you find your calling, and you try to fulfill it, to live the kind of life that you want to live—it is then that you really become healthy. When you follow a predetermined path, when you follow what others have told you, you might fulfill every person’s expectations, but deep down you will feel sad and suppressed. And, personally, I didn’t want to grow older, and reach a very old age and be filled with regrets—regrets about not having lived the way I wanted to live, and also regrets of not having tried, at least, to turn my dreams into reality.

What I’m saying to people is that it’s better to try and to fail than not to try at all, because not to try at all is a certain failure. So even if you reach that old age that I’m talking about, at least even if you have not achieved to live your ideal life, you still know that you tried your best. And I think that’s enough not to be filled with regrets that I see most people have.

Natasha: You know, so far I’m hearing you speak and listening to your story, and I can’t help but reflect back upon what we were chatting about earlier—in healing this idea of separateness that we have. And it really sounds like you were feeling so separate from yourself, and from the world around you, and therefore suffering. I just can’t help but wonder how many other people are feeling that way. How many other people are kind of holding this belief about themselves to be true that have just been passed down through generations, but without challenging that. But at the same time feeling so separate from themselves because they feel like it’s not who they are and what they want for life, but aren’t able to kind of break free of that. And I’m wondering if you could maybe share a little bit around how did you actually transition into, “Okay, this is kind of what I’ve been taught, this is no longer what I believe to be true for me, this is what I’m going to do instead.” How did you make that transition?

Sofo: Well, as I said, since I didn’t accept what is “normal,” I started to question all my beliefs. And you know, when you question things, a lot of beautiful answers come along your journey. And it is not that, you know, I’m the wisest person or the most intelligent person and the answers just came to my mind. I started searching. I started researching. I started reading books. I started learning from people that have already experienced what I’m experiencing and share their knowledge as to how one can overcome their problems.

And I realized a lot has to do with suppression, as I discussed before. So I started doing more and more of the things that I like doing. The other thing I realized is that it is good to have people around you that you really feel a connection with, and not to be with people that burden your psyche and influence you into all sorts of negativities. Another thing that is our basic need but many of us don’t pay attention to is our physical body. How can we keep it healthy? So I immersed myself into nutrition and I changed the way I eat, and I started to feel immediately better. And the tool that for me was the most important in helping me be more calm, be more peaceful, feel connected with others, was meditation.

Natasha: So what does your meditation practice look like right now, Sofo?

Sofo: Well, right now I’m not so much into practicing. I do practice from time to time the meditation practice that is called mindfulness, which is perhaps the oldest meditation technique and perhaps the simplest, in the sense that you just have to sit down somewhere quietly—you can sit down on the floor cross-legged, or you can sit on a chair. And you just observe your thoughts, or you can observe your breath as it goes in and out.

But as I said, I don’t practice so much right now. I used to practice a lot, day in and day out for years, when I was feeling very depressed and very stressed. When I wanted to transform my life but I didn’t know how to, and I had found this tool that helped me be centered and focused. Now I have built my life around things that I love doing and around people that I love being with, so I don’t so much feel the need to be disciplined and meditate every day. But whenever I feel that I want to sit alone and reflect and regain a peaceful state of mind, I do it. I just don’t force myself.

Natasha: I think that’s a really great thing. And I think using meditation as a tool—just as you said, it was a way to help you transition. I as well, if there’s a decision that I am struggling with to make, or a problem that has arisen that I would like answers on, I’ll meditate on it. And it’s amazing how it changes your state, and therefore it changes the questions that we ask, so they’re much better, higher quality questions, rather than questions that kind of keep us stuck.

We’ve spoken a lot about expressing your creativity, and that’s what I love about your work—it’s that’s just what you do. You are in the creative process all the time. So I’m wondering, is there any way that you would suggest our listeners kind of tap into getting familiar with that side of themselves? I believe that we all have a creative part of ourselves that we may kind of mask or not necessarily are conscious of. Is there anything that you would recommend listeners do to help them either see that part of themselves, and/or tap into that part of themselves?

Sofo: I think that each and every person has a gift, each and every person is unique and has something important to contribute to this world. And I think that people need to look into what makes them really happy, what makes them feel joy, what turns life into a celebration. And whatever that is—whether it is writing or painting or composing music or, you know, making podcasts like you do— they have to spend more time doing this.

Our everyday life is filled with so many distractions, and we do so many things that only bring negativity into ourselves, and we don’t spend even an hour meditating or creating something that can really make us feel so much better, that can transform the way we live.

Now, I would suggest people to do what they love doing when they feel like doing it. Personally, I don’t have like a discipline, I don’t have a writing or painting schedule. When I feel most inspired to write or paint, this is when I start writing on my keyboard or this is when I take a brush and start painting on the canvas. I feel that we should not force creativity. Creativity is something that should sprout from within ourselves spontaneously. And when we try to force it, to control it, it turns into destruction. I think creativity is something like love—when you force love, it turns into rape. When you don’t force it, it is true, unconditional love.

Natasha: No matter what hour of the day. It could be 3am when that inspiration hits.

Sofo: Well, you know, many people say that they like to wake up in the morning and be productive, and that this is when they are most creative. But what I have experienced in my life is, yes, in the morning you can be creative, but I think that we can be more creative in the night, because then our unconscious, which is connected with our imagination, is starting to work more. And I find myself that whenever I have the greatest ideas about something that I want to write or paint, usually they come in the night. And I have found myself many times staying up until late working on what I really want to work on.

Now, I understand that many people have a nine-to-five job, they have to wake up early, so I would not suggest anyone to take it to extremes, because they might mess up their so-called biological clock—their physical organism and how it functions. And we need to keep our bodies functioning optimally. But sometimes, yes, you have to stay up a little bit late. We don’t need to be robots. We don’t need to be so disciplined.

Natasha: Yeah, that goes right back to your comment earlier around creativity not being pushed upon us, because it just doesn’t happen that way.

Natasha: Exactly.

Natasha: Oh Sofo, there’s so much more I’d like to dive into. I’m cognizant of the time, however. We’ll have to have you back, so I can ask you so many more questions that I have for you. I do, however, like to ask a question at the end of all my interviews, and that question goes like this: if the world was in your classroom and you were a teacher, what would the name of your lesson be?

Sofo: I would say—trust yourself. Trust that inner voice that is telling you that life could be much more beautiful. That we are not meant to hate Mondays. That, really, life is wonderful and we can live so much better, so much better, so much more in joy. And this voice, this inner voice of ours, has been forgotten by many of us. But it is there all the time, talking to us. It’s just that we don’t pay attention to it. And I think that we should all turn our attention inwards and pay attention to it, because it can guide us and lead us to an amazingly beautiful life—for us and every human being, because we’re all connected.